Lets have an honest thread on the topic of race. Just share honest thoughts. Don't overly censor yourself, but don't make a joke of this either. I want us to have a serious and honest conversation on the subject.

I do accept that race is a biological reality, not just a cultural construct. I do not posit the idea of one master race, as there have been worthy societies produced by multiple races, such as the civilizations of Europe and of Asia, when considered together. I however, view with immense doubt and skepticism the claim that all races, on average, have the same level of intellect. But, I don't support any nature of social system based on de jure racial stratification, because there are always outliers in any population, and its hard to measure these things in a manner that would enable simple categorization. I'm not about sterilizing someone over an IQ test.

I want thoughts.

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If someone is relatively unintelligent, doesn't it follow that they probably won't do as well as someone who is intelligent?

Not really. "emotional intelligence" is as important if not more. lots of low-functioning geniuses out there, and lots of rich, relatively unintelligent people that just worked their ass off

"If someone is relatively unintelligent, doesn't it follow that they probably won't do as well as someone who is intelligent?" 

That depends on how you define "do well".

In any event, if you're born into wealth, there's a very good chance that you'll retain that wealth, or even increase it, because you have the resources to support you and/or do it for you despite how smart or dumb you are.

Likewise, if you're born into poverty and debt, there's a very good chance that you'll remain in poverty and debt regardless of how smart or dumb you are or how hard you work at getting out of that hole.

In both cases, it's not impossible to change your current situation. But it's difficult. In one case, you've got an infrastructure set up for you and around you to keep you afloat. In the other case, you're starting from 100 miles behind the starting line with every obstacle in the book being thrown at you.

"I think you are mistaking the lower socioeconomic status as a cause for lower intelligence, when it's really the other way around."

I'm not saying that low intelligence can't cause low socioeconomic status for an individual or a group of individuals. I'm saying that the people who professionally study this kind of stuff (criminologists, sociologists, etc.) are convinced that your socioeconomic background is a bigger determining factor in how well you'll do in school, business and life than your race or the score you can get on an IQ test.

I've heard more stories of people pulling themselves out of poverty, then I have of those loosing all the family money they were born into.  Perhaps that is just because the success story is the story we all love to hear?  Not sure...

At any rate, I don't agree that "Blacks" are genetically less intelligent then other races because of a "Thug Culture"...

Oh, I think MANY BUT NOT ALL "blacks"  IN THE UNITED STATES are encumbered by "thug culture", or rather by an acceptance/pride in ignorance. Or maybe a contempt for being perceived as "acting white"

Case in point ebonics. "Axe her do she want mo?"

Now, there is a similar stain in the white community. Lots of southerners like to posture themselves as ignorant hicks even if they aren't. 

Now, there is a similar stain in the white community. Lots of southerners like to posture themselves as ignorant hicks even if they aren't. 


Get this-- I know someone who isn't really an ignorant hick, but pretends she is. She grew up as an ignorant suburbia resident. So she's not a poseur when it comes to the ignorant part, just the hick part. Because listening to Florida Georgia Line makes you the next Jed Clampett. Irrelevant, but I think it's interesting.

I was just trying to point out that saying genetically less intelligent due to a cultural aspect, seems rather short sided...

Not saying it doesn't exist, but to liken that to a lack of intelligence in the "Black" community...Nah...Not buying it...

Clinton, I can't parse what you're saying. "Genetically less intelligent due to a cultural aspect" seems like a contradiction in terms.  

What is it you're not buying?


Just trying to figure out PH's meaning Sir...

There is some research that shows that blacks on average have lower intelligence. If this evidence is to be accepted, it has to be genetic. There's no other viable way. However, I believe this is caused by a thug culture that has stunted the intellectual growth of the black race.

I'm trying to figure out how it's genetically tied to a thug culture...

Is it a perceived lack of intelligence instead of an actual lack of intelligence?  Am I just misunderstanding PH's angle?

In my point of view, correlation doesn't equal causation.

I'm saying it's like artificial selection. A culture that was possibly already present among the less intelligent has been glamorized by the elite trying to carpetbag. They attract the unintelligent, promote procreation, and keep making money off the vicious cycle that has begun.

A compelling story.  But do we have evidence that this lowers IQ scores (if that's what you're saying)?

Or that the elite promote procreation?  Don't they actually do the opposite these days, by warning of overpopulation and promoting abortion and birth control?

Now I understand your question -- and share it.


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