"All I can say is that any man whose identity and self worth is shaped by cartoon characters and TV sitcoms bloody well gets what he deserves. "
God or evolutison likely both.
Here we have two ideas god and evoluison both have some compealing evidence. we know things change to fit their envoirment the changes occuer over time thus evoluison. With god we see how things like selflessness and basic sympathy come from despite them breaking evolutison so here we have two issues with out evoluison animales would all be gone with out a god then we would all be the orcs from lord of the rings. it seems only when both are allowed to exist does humanity as we know it logicly exist.
Tags: debate, evolutison, god, reglion, sicense
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Liam S. on -
im going to need to see your evidence that the world is working with out him.
For reference, see: Science. Most all of it.
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Permalink Reply by Justin Cook on -
not good at what jon?
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Permalink Reply by JonEdanger on -
The whole "debating on the internet" thing.
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Permalink Reply by Shane on -
Justin has some medical issues with his writing abilities. He's ok, we make allowances.
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Permalink Reply by JonEdanger on
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I don't remember him ever saying that his writing disability extended to logical thinking, however.
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Permalink Reply by Justin Cook on
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ok liam but sicense hasent fully explianed how are universe other wise there would be no christan physicists. Yes my writing such for several reasons a learning disabilty one of them how ever it doesent effect my abilty to use logic so please do not hold back as doing so would only offend me. Now i gave i feel fair proof for the possabilty of a god. now i need proof that the isnt one or i will move one to prove not only that gods possable but likely.
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Permalink Reply by Liam S. on
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I'm not saying science disproves god, or that a believer can't find a way for them to work together.
But science does build a compelling picture of a universe that does not require a god to work. You can keep putting god into those places science hasn't figured out yet - but what then when it does? The "god of the gaps" is an untenable position.
Science will likely never be able to disprove the existence of god. Nor would I claim he doesn't exist. My claim is only that I have not seen anything that suggests he does, or that he is required (much less any particular god) for the universe to work as we see it. There is no evidence in the function of the universe (or our world) *for* god.
But believers have done without such evidence for thousands of years. Believe what you will. Just don't claim you have evidence, when at best, you have a partial case for plausibility without a demonstrated need. It's a bit like saying your car runs because of the burning fuel in the engine (etc.), but also because of god. It works without the god part. The function of the car doesn't demonstrate god's existence - only that he *could* be there, doing the same thing the engine already does. -
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Permalink Reply by Justin Cook on
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im saying with out god we wouldnt have rules like conservatison of energy or all the forces that hold every thing together we may know the how but not the why. sicense does a good job at how we got here but cant explain why in a philosopic sense were here. it would be rather depressing to say there's no point to it all.
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Permalink Reply by Liam S. on
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I understand what you are saying, but we do not have evidence for that. Again, the god of the gaps - if you want to believe god created the physical constants - go right ahead, but there is nothing to suggest he did. As I stated before, there is alot about them we don't know, including that they may not even be the key to the structure of the universe - they might just be all we can see.
And the "why" is not something that can be tested.
Saying that the "why" is god's work, doesn't tell us anything. First off, we don't know that it actually was god. Then we don't know which god. Then, we still don't know why. "God did it" doesn't provide an answer. It just shoves the question up a level.
It might be depressing to say there is no point at all, but deciding that therefor there must be a god to give the universe a purpose, doesn't follow logically.
It may be that there is no point.
We can't know.
All we can do is decide how to live our own lives, and derive our own purpose. -
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Permalink Reply by JonEdanger on
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Somewhere between
the time
you arrive
and the time
you go
May lie
a reason
you were
alive
but you'll
never know.
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