You guys are great! When circumcised men refuse to circumcise their kids, it rekindles my faith in humanity.
A big part of the issue of why circumcision is still around is that the procedure, as well as causing physical damage, tends to impart a subconscious psychological need to circumcise in the victim, so circumcised men revisit the practice by insisting it's done to their own sons. The stories I had heard suggested to me that this need was almost insurmountable, because what a victim has to accept when he refuses to do it to his sons is that what was done to him by his caregivers was wrong and damaging. That is a hard thing for many people to admit.
Clearly, many of the men here were either not affected by this psychological trauma, or they found it possible to overcome it. This gives me great hope that this practice will soon end, and that is something I hadn't believed in a while.
I'm still unconvinced. As a result of what I've read in here, I'll probably not only circumcise my sons but, just to be safe, my daughters too. You can never be too careful.
So I had sex with a new girl two nights ago, and she said to me, "I haven't had a cut guy in a while. Tell me where you're sensitive."
So we fell to talking about the differences in where I and uncircumcised guys were sensitive. Pretty different, in fact.
I think circumcision is a bad practice, as I've said before. I really think you shouldn't permanently cut something off of a human being's body until they're old enough to consent. But that's just an ethical scruple. I feel zero anger toward my parents for their decision.
I guess my conversation with her made me realize why I don't myself feel victimized or unhappy about my parents' decision. I can see that ethically it was a bad decision, but I've never once wished I still had my foreskin. For those of us who are cut, while maybe we haven't been given the fullest freedom of our bodies, but we haven't really been crippled either. I've never felt I'm missing out on anything. I'm just sensitive in different places.
So I guess I'm one of those circumcised guys who wouldn't circumcise my own kids (which I don't have) but I don't feel angry about it.
An amazing blowjob is an amazing blowjob, whatever you're working with. So I guess circumcision is logically and ethically bad, but it's not the end of the world. So take heart, ye who wish you still had your foreskins.
I don't think anyone's saying that circumcised guys must be angry about it. However, I think one of the important points is that there is good reason, for those who are angry about it, to be angry about it, especially given that there are folks here and elsewhere who find it a subject for humor. One of the biggest problems with circumcision is that people who are mature enough that it never enters their heads to make jokes about rape, child abuse, animal torture or female circumcision find it so easy to make light of male circumcision. As Christopher Hitchens famously said "Genital mutilation is no joke":
Oh, I completely agree with you. It is a bad practice. Just saying that I'm lucky. Sure, if people are upset, they have a right to be. I'm a huge Hitchens fan as you may know. I've seen this video before. I agree with him. But life is still good. So just wanted people to take heart and not be too depressed if this has been done to you.
Ian, & Brad,
I just watched the video, and indeed, genital mutilation is no joke. I think that any person that advocates the same, should be called to answer for it.
We should understand, however, that the wholesale removal of the frenulum and ridged band that is performed in hospitals and back-alleys around the world today, bares little resemblance to the circumcision described in Genesis. The removal of half the skin of a normal penis was not done until 140 years after Christ was born. It was done in retaliation for those Jews that wanted to restore the tip of the foreskin that had been cut off.
I'm glad that you are still able to climax even after half of the skin on your penis was removed, but the fact that you can have an orgasm isn't the same as the full range of sensitivity that you could have.
A study published in the British Journal of Urology International found that there are significant differences between what a circumcised, and an uncircumcised man feels.
Researchers measured fine-touch sensitivity of the penis at 17 specific sites on the intact (non-circumcised) penis and the remaining 9 sites plus two scar sites on the circumcised penis. The results surprised the research team, according to Morris Sorrells, MD, lead researcher, who said, "The most sensitive part of the penis is the preputial opening. The results confirmed that the frenulum and ridged band of the inner foreskin are highly erogenous structures that are routinely removed by circumcision, leaving the penis with one-fourth the fine-touch sensitivity it originally possessed." Five sites on the penis-all regularly removed by circumcision-are more sensitive than the most sensitive site remaining on the circumcised penis. Researcher pediatrician and statistician Robert Van Howe said, "Oddly, the most sensitive site on the circumcised penis is the circumcision scar itself."
Brad, you can do that test yourself. Your girlfriend wisely knew that what would be pleasing to an uncut man, would not do much for you, because those parts are missing. Further, if you think about it, the most sensitive place left, the little bump on the front of the shaft, if you were lucky enough to have a surgeon that didn't gouge it out, is only the scarred remainder of what was your frenulum.
Here is a summary of the full study. http://www.nocirc.org/touch-test/touchtest.php
And the full study. http://www.nocirc.org/touch-test/bju_6685.pdf
Reading this thread makes my feelings that I'll never get to raise a son go bye-bye.
Gives me the willies! And no clear answer; I see it as a barbaric ritual foisted on babies, but I also see what a pain in the ass going the other route can be.
And then there's the whole getting naked with daddy thing...yikes.
Girls have been so much easier.
Having had both boys and girls, I can say that raising each is wonderful, and yes -- different.
I wouldn't give away the joy of having sons for anything, and really up until the time they entered puberty, I had nothing to worry about, or task that needed doing. The foreskin is a natural structure. Your dog, your horse, and any other mammal you have ever met, has a foreskin, and manages to survive, and thrive with no outside care.
If you ever were to have a someday teenage son, and he wanted to clean under his foreskin. Great.
Trust me, the average teenage boy will figure out how his penis works, foreskin and all, whether you tell him or not.
Sharing some bonding time with your son is purely optional, but think about it, if you aren't comfortable talking about hygiene, how can you really expect that he will turn to you when it becomes a matter of who to have sex with?