Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Liam S. on May 7, 2012 at 11:05pm

For me, it is not a matter of preference. I have seen no evidence or effective argument to lead me to believe a deity (any deity) exists. And so I am an atheist. 

As for what my atheism offers - nothing, in and of itself. It is not a philosophy and offers no guidance. But I am an artist, skeptic, humanist, and a scientist - and those help me frame my life, provide a method to determine answers to difficult questions and deal with the unknown without resorting to more mysteries to answer them. And that provides me with some peace and happiness, and I hope, when I am gone, I leave the world better than I found it. 

As for why it appears to be on the rise, it is hard to say. We don't have very good numbers for how many atheists have been around historically - for one, it was illegal or culturally frowned on for a long time, and many people likely just went with the flow to avoid shame/fear/punishment, etc. It may just be that it is more socially accepted, and so more are "out of the closet" to borrow a term. 

Certainly we are more vocal. But I don't know if that actually translates to higher numbers. 

Permalink Reply by Jack Bauer on May 7, 2012 at 11:15pm

That wasn't the question, though.  It wasn't "why do you like atheism" ... it was "what does atheism have to offer".  That presumably means to Christians and atheists alike.

 

The bottom line is truth.  No other "offer" matters.  Truth is all that need be offered, and belief systems that are untrue are mere temptations.

 

JB

Permalink Reply by Peyton Quinn on May 8, 2012 at 12:00am

"Truth is all that need be offered, and belief systems that are untrue are mere temptations "

 

This isso totally circular logic and thus not truely logical at all but fallacy itself. It could well be used as an "errors in logic' exmaple in University textbook. One might as wells say, "The sky is blue because clealry the sky is blue". No information is exchanged there at all.

This is another aspect that puzzles non christitans about Christian thought and even its fundamental dogmas, when asked they most often quote biblical scripture itself as if it were an 'argument' and 'logic' or even 'evidence' itself.

But one has to be born into a household that brings one up personaly with that 'brainnwashing' or indoctrination or what evre one choses to call it.Nobody ever thought this stuff up on their own after all in any of its many sects which often contradict one another in such fundamtnal ways.  but so many people calling themselves Chritians seem totslly bind to that reality.

They speak if they were born in Bagada they would still be Chrisitans somehow.

Then they doom others to hell, which to afully  rational person is just such childish non-sense of course, just for not being born in a Chirtian home and accpeting Christ as their 'own personal savior'. 

 Yet they often see Calavanism's pre-destination as being 'non Christian'. How does that work?

WE know the planet is millions of years old and mankind has been here only about 500,000 to one million years tops, a short span planet wise yet many Chrisitians tell me they belive in an earth 3 to 5ooo years old as biblical gospel indicates.

Now here we get some rational commuciation between some Chritians and non christians with the acceptance of what a day is for 'God', maybe our 24 hrs or maybe a million years.

Most Chritians can't see that at all their arguments have a basis somehow to them as Chrittians, or even an irrefutable support through some scriptural quote, when to someone not in that mindset has a very challenging and hard time even grasping what they mean or think in terms of what they quated as somehow supporting their position and thought. This is true regradless of how many time or how well the non Christian they arte speaking too knows the Christsan bibles themselves.

I am not at all agisnt Christiantiy. Yet somehowsomeChristians feel I am. How does this work and yet be truly consaistent with true Christian thought or what ther own Jesus is said to have spoken and preached?

Permalink Reply by Jack Bauer on May 8, 2012 at 12:23am

Huh?  I'm not sure if you misunderstood me, or what.  I never declared what was true and what wasn't -- I simply said that truth is the only useful criteria.  You can determine what you believe to be true on your own ... but, if you're using criteria other than 'truth', you're missing the boat.

 

How is that illogical?

 

If atheism is true, then Christianity is a mere crutch for the superstitious.  If Christianity is true, then atheism is a mere temptation for the hedonistic or self-absorbed.  It doesn't matter what else they "offer" (salvation is irrelevant if it isn't true; the freedom of Godlessness is ill-advised if there is a God).  Truth is all that matters.

 

I don't quote the Bible to atheists.  If they don't buy into the source, what good comes from quoting it?  Then again, I also don't evangelize to atheists.  Evangelism is a calling for better men than I.  I haven't the patience.

 

I've never met a Christian that believed the Earth was 5000 years old.  I hear about them from atheists all the time, though.  I tend to think they're a caricature that atheists invented for rhetorical impact.

 

JB

Permalink Reply by Netza R. on May 8, 2012 at 12:29am

at least one person in this chatroom does believe in a young earth, from his own words

Permalink Reply by Liam S. on May 8, 2012 at 12:33am

Including the original poster of this topic. 

Permalink Reply by Netza R. on May 8, 2012 at 12:35am

thats who I meant... but its cool I like Herb thats why I didnt want to do the singleing out

Permalink Reply by Liam S. on May 8, 2012 at 12:40am

More than him, though, I suspect. I don't think he'd be bothered by being singled out. 

Permalink Reply by Elliott Jason Ridgway on May 10, 2012 at 3:17pm

I personally know hundreds of Christians who believe that the Humanity, the Earth, and the rest of the Universe is roughly 6000 years old... I am not one of them.  

I have briefly looked into the reasoning and evidence for the Young Earth theory, and while it may have some merits, I don't find them to be conclusive... 

A proper Hermeneutic will lead a rational fellow to conclude that much of the Bible is meant to be literal, some of it is meant to be poetic or symbolic, and some Scripture is both Literal and symbolic when it comes to prophecy...

One interesting thing about the Creation account in Genesis having to do with the "six days of creation" and the lord resting on the 7th day is the symbolic application for God's relationship with humanity over the course of the last 6 thousand years, and the prophecies of the coming Millennial (1000 year) reign of Christ... the words used to describe each of the six days can be applied to God pointing towards the Cross of Christ in the OT and referring back to it in the NT... it also has symbolic applications for the edification (mind) and sanctification (heart) growth process for a Believer in their relationship with Jesus Christ...

Honestly, I don't have a horse in this fight... (to conflate cliche's)... I believe that God created the Universe and Humanity; and that it isn't random chance of impersonal forces... the mechanics and details of how God did this is interesting to me, but the jury is still out on which theory best describes the evidence gathered... Essentially, the distant past and the distant future are inconsequential when it comes to having a personal relationship with jesus Christ right now...

Permalink Reply by Titus Techera on May 8, 2012 at 12:39am

You seem to be implying believing in a young earth is a sign of mental weakness, to put it charitably. Do you care to explain why, if that is what you are implying?

Permalink Reply by Netza R. on May 8, 2012 at 12:44am

Im implying its NOT TRUE

Permalink Reply by Titus Techera on May 8, 2012 at 12:46am

I do not think you care to prove the negative. But do you care to prove that the earth is old, older say than whatever the young earth theory purports?

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